“Reassuring people, showing empathy: a robot can never take over that”

Who are the people who consciously choose to work in the pension industry? What do they do every day to take care of your pension? And what do they love about their work? In the series “The person behind your pension,” we take you behind the scenes. This time: 
Sanni Kluitenberg is team manager of APG's Customer Contact Center.

You've been working at APG for three years. How did you end up here? Were you fascinated by pensions?
“I wasn't. I studied International bussiness administration. Then I was a trainee at Koning & Hartman and then at Boels Rental, a machine and tool rental company. There I gained experience as team lead of the contact center. Boels is a nice company, but very commercial. And I really wanted to add something to society. During a weekend trip with girlfriends I jokingly said: hey, if anyone is still looking for a contact center manager? And then one of them told me that her friend, who also works at APG, had a vacancy. That was on Saturday afternoon and the application deadline closed on Sunday evening. So I squeezed out a letter very quickly.”

You knew immediately: this is it?
“The very first job interview felt like a breath of fresh air. Pension is very important in life, that appeals to me. Now, together with three more team managers, one in Heerlen and two in Amsterdam, I manage about 120 contact specialists.”

People call the Customer Contact Center (KCC) with questions about their pensions. So as a manager, do you have to know a lot about that?
“No way, the most important thing is to be curious. I'm interested in people, processes, business interests. That way your pension knowledge also grows a bit, but fortunately for the real content there are many experts. They know exactly what a contact specialist should pay attention to. My job is to motivate employees, to let them grow. And to ensure that processes and working agreements are clear. It helps to have no knowledge of pensions, because I never get bogged down in: 'Yes, but we've always done it this way'. I think about the logic behind a certain way of working.”

What does an average day look like for you?
“I usually get calls as early as 7:30 in the morning with all kinds of questions from contact specialists. They are 'on the line' from eight o'clock. At the office I start with a number of day starts; what needs to be done today? Furthermore, I now have many consultations about the transition of our pension fund clients to the renewed pension system. Are there changes in the systems and processes or in communication with participants? What impact will that have on the contact specialists? Of course, I also consult with my team members to check that everything is going well.” 

Is the KCC being called more often now with questions about the updated pension system? 
“Yes, but those questions are usually quite simple. People just want to know: how much pension can I count on later? And what will change for me? What makes it difficult is that we have to get the answers from data systems that are not yet working perfectly. For example, because they are being worked on, so they are temporarily inaccessible. Or because certain data are not yet complete. It requires a lot of skills from the contact specialists to reassure callers about that.” 

In the MijnOmgeving, of course, participants also find information. And there is a chatbot. So how important is the possibility of human contact still?
“Very important. And I think it will only become more important in the future. Many questions can be answered well through AI. But more complex situations require human contact. For example, when participants have to make life-defining choices, or experience a major event such as the death of their partner. In such cases, empathy is needed to help someone move on. Sensing people, reassuring them: a robot can never take over that.”

What fascinates you in your work?
“I really enjoy working with many different people. There are young and older employees at the KCC, people who have a lot of experience or who are just out of school, and everything in between. And with each employee we look at: what do you need? How can we get the best out of you? What does that require from you and from me?” 

That shows a lot of personal attention. 
“APG is a top employer. I say that to everyone. I think there are very few employers in the Netherlands that think along with their employees in this way. What APG offers in terms of employment conditions, I find exceptional. From computer glasses to a vitality budget and even an internet allowance for working from home. 
But I also notice that commitment in the way my supervisor deals with me, the trust that is there and the space you are given. I really appreciate that.”

So you're not leaving here for a while? 
“I'm so excited about the work I'm doing now! I'm brimming with energy, wanting to think about and contribute to everything. Sometimes I do find it difficult to take a step back so that I can keep it up. In the end, a day has only 24 hours for me too. As a result, I also don't look far ahead, which is actually a pitfall. But I see myself working at APG for a long time to come. In time I would like to become a senior manager.”

You probably also see areas for improvement?
“What strikes me is that APG staff know very little about what colleagues in other teams are doing. While everything is connected: every department is part of the chain. You often only find out what the other team is up against when you have a problem. Then you realize: hey, we should indeed do that differently. I think we would function even better if we knew more about each other's work.”

You're brimming with energy, you said. How do you recharge it outside APG? 
“I like to listen to music, go to concerts regularly. I myself play trumpet and keyboard, and I sing sometimes. And I take walks with Zorro, our dog. In April I will start motorcycle riding lessons, because I would like to ride motorcycles with my boyfriend.

For a few years now, we have been living in a house that is more than a hundred years old. Some days it is the most beautiful house in the world because it has a lot of potential. On other days I curse it because it leaks, squeaks and creaks on all sides. It needs a lot of refurbishing, but the cost of that is skyrocketing and besides, craftsmen are very busy right now. We keep it up as much as possible ourselves, but we can't do big jobs like replacing window frames. In the little spare time that is left, we like to travel around Europe.”